Question

Topic: E-Marketing

Minor Ethical Dilemma: Thoughts Appreciated

Posted by Inbox_Interactive on 12/23/2004 at 11:38 AM ET 250 Points
I know this is slightly off-topic, but I am not sure how active the "All Other" category is. Also, I am most familiar with the people who participate in this category, and their feedback is of the greatest value to me.

Having said that...

I bought a new-in-box digital camera on eBay for under $200 including shipping. It's worth about $300. (I sure hope the wife's not reading this, otherwise this gift will not be a surprise!)

Long story short, I've come to learn that the seller took my $200 via PayPal, then used a stolen credit card number to buy the camera for $311 from target.com. (The camera was shipped to me directly from target.com, which struck me as odd, so I called them and, after researching the transaction thoroughly, came to this conclusion.)

When all is said and done, the only one who will be "out" any money is the credit card company as they will eat the loss. I know that this is a cost of business that they live with every day, so I don't feel quite as bad about it as I would if an individual were going to take the loss.

However, I do feel like my purchase is tainted. I was able to benefit only because of an illegal transaction.

I won't send the camera back because I would then be out the entire $200. I want to do the right thing, but not at a cost of $200.

Questions:

Is there a "right thing" here for me to do? If so, what?

I'm thinking about making a donation of $100 to a charity so that my total "spend" will be $300, the fair market value of the camera.

What would you do?

Paul

P.S. I have filed a report with the IFCC (part of the FBI) so that target.com will not think that I was the one who actually placed the order with the stolen credit card number.
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RESPONSES

  • Posted by Carl Crawford on 12/23/2004 at 12:43 PM Member
    Paul,

    That is the reason i will Never use ebay or online trading sites ,and another reason why i dont like paypal .It is to dam easy to get your money stolen, frozen, misplaced.

    Like Randall has said, do what you feel is right. Personally i would not really give a dam because credit cards are too dam expensive 21% interest and they build it into there plan for this thing to happen.

    $100 to a charity sounds good to me.

    Carl Crawford
  • Posted by Inbox_Interactive on 12/23/2004 at 12:54 PM Author
    Just to clarify, the stolen credit card number was not mine. I am not "out" even one cent.

    1. I bought the camera on eBay, paying for it with an AMEX via PayPal. My price: $200. I got what I was expecting in that I paid $200 for a camera that I thought would cost me $200, even though it's worth more (but not so much more that I should have known something was up).

    2. The seller takes my $200 via PayPal and hopefully does at least *something* worthwhile with it like pay rent, buy groceries, or keep the heat on. Somehow, I don't think this is where the money went, though.

    3. The seller then uses a stolen credit number belonging to a completely unrelated third party and buys the camera from target.com for full retail value (over $300), using my name and address as the buyer. He also gave a completely fake email address that used my name to give it the appearance of authenticity (pbroni@att.net, an account I've never had).

    As far as target.com would know, I placed an order using a stolen credit card number. That is why I filed with the FBI, so that I could document that it was not me who did this.

    When all is said and done, I'm not out anything, because I got the basis of my bargain. I spent $200 to get a camera that, in my eyes, cost $200.

    I just wish that my "savvy" purchase was not facilitated by a crime. Actually, if I were really going to do my part to right the wrong, I'd send the additional $100 to the credit card company to partially cover their loss.

    For some reason, though, this seems as unlikely as when the IRS tells you that you can always make extra tax payments to the Bureau of Public Debt in case you want to give even more. I bet that is one empty, lonely P.O. Box!

    Paul
  • Posted by Carl Crawford on 12/23/2004 at 1:28 PM Member
    did the person have a rating? in some of the New Zealand ones you have the ability to *RATE* each seller for performance. Never buy anything from a new person or someone who has bad reviews.

    Look at it this way, you are going to get ripped off by someone somewhere at one point in your life eg bad business deal, government mixing your taxes up etc.

    think of it as "pay back by the universe", for all you know the holder of the credit card might be a terrorist who was planning another 9/11 but now does not have enough money to bribe the guard at the boarded patrol so he can get the explosives into the country. Or worse, a marketer how markets porn or smokes.

    it will all even out in the end.
  • Posted by Peter (henna gaijin) on 12/23/2004 at 1:53 PM Member
    To me, the only additional thing you may want to do (if you haven't), is ensure that the credit card company (or who ever is researching this) has the information about the PayPal account which you paid to. This may be useful for them to track the perpetrator down, as PayPal likely has some information which could be used to connect to the person.
  • Posted by SRyan ;] on 12/23/2004 at 2:43 PM Member
    Paul, you're one of the VICTIMS in this scam, you aren't the criminal.

    Do as everyone suggests -- cooperate fully with the eBay, PayPal, Target, the g-men. I'd say that's more than enough effort on your part to have a clear conscience.

    You have nothing to feel guilty about, so be proud of your generous gift to your wife and forget the ordeal.

    - Shelley
  • Posted by Deremiah *CPE on 12/23/2004 at 3:53 PM Member
    Paul,

    I wish I could add to what has already been said but truly you have done no wrong. Your understanding of the bad transaction after the transaction is your saving grace. Had you known in advance what scam was going on and you still participated then you would be an accessory to the crime but that's not the case. You are a wise man to have notified all of the affected parties. Your tansaction was an honest cost of doing business.

    Kiss your wife and wish her a wonderful, happy and prosperous holiday. Go in Peace!

    Your Servant, Deremiah, *CPE
  • Posted by Pepper Blue on 12/24/2004 at 1:40 AM Member
    Hi Paul,

    I think you have the CYA on fraud pretty well covered, so you can probably put that to bed.

    If this leaves you rest assured that everybody else is over it and moving on, then you and your conscience are the only victims that now need to do that, so if donating $100 does that, go for it, $100 will put a lot of food on a lot of peoples tables and isn't a bad thing to do anytime of year for no particular reason.

    Give your wife the camera, enjoy it and it will now not only create memories and record your family history but it already has one of its own.

    Have a great Christmas/Holiday!

    TP

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